Proof that limit in a Hausdorff space is unique
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This proof is likely quite trivial, but I was hoping someone could look it over regardless. There is one particular step I am confused on.
Theorem. The limit of a convergent sequence in a Hausdorff space is unique.
Proof. Let $a_n$ be a convergent sequence in a Hausdorf space. Suppose, for a contradiction, that it converges to two different points, $x$ and $y$. Thus, it follows from converges to $x$ that
begin{align*}
forall epsilon > 0, exists N, forall n > N, |a_n - x | < epsilon,
end{align*}
which is otherwise stated that for all $n > N$, elements of the sequence lie in some open ball around $x$ with radius $epsilon$.
From convergence to $y$, it follows that
begin{align*}
forall epsilon > 0, exists N, forall n > N, |a_n - y| < epsilon,
end{align*}
otherwise stated that for all $n > N$, elements of the sequence lie in an open ball around $x$ with radius $epsilon$.
Here is where my confusion comes in. From here, I know I need to draw on the definition of Hausdorff space. These are distinct points, and so there exist open sets around them containing the points, $x$ and $y$, where these sets are disjoint. This does not imply that every open set containing these points is disjoint. So, it seems that I need to say something to the effect that the definition of convergence allows me to create an open ball (I am using this interchangeable with open set, which I hope isn't incorrect; please correct me, if so) of any radius I want around
the points, and thus it clearly captures all such open sets. Thus, I can pick two separate $N$'s for each of these sets to form open balls of radius $epsilon_1$ and $epsilon_2$ around these points such that the sets are disjoint, which I know I can do via the definition of Hausdorff space. Since this would be true for an infinite number of $n$ past some arbitrary point $N$, it would not be possible to get "back inside" the opening ball around the other point. That's clearly a contradiction to the definition of convergence. Thus, if $a_n$ converges to $x$, it cannot converge to $y$, and if it converges to $y$, it cannot converge to $x$, so there is only a single possible limit point, which is unique.
How does this argument sound? Is there a better way to state it, or have I made an errors in logic?
Thanks in advance.
sequences-and-series general-topology proof-verification convergence
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up vote
2
down vote
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This proof is likely quite trivial, but I was hoping someone could look it over regardless. There is one particular step I am confused on.
Theorem. The limit of a convergent sequence in a Hausdorff space is unique.
Proof. Let $a_n$ be a convergent sequence in a Hausdorf space. Suppose, for a contradiction, that it converges to two different points, $x$ and $y$. Thus, it follows from converges to $x$ that
begin{align*}
forall epsilon > 0, exists N, forall n > N, |a_n - x | < epsilon,
end{align*}
which is otherwise stated that for all $n > N$, elements of the sequence lie in some open ball around $x$ with radius $epsilon$.
From convergence to $y$, it follows that
begin{align*}
forall epsilon > 0, exists N, forall n > N, |a_n - y| < epsilon,
end{align*}
otherwise stated that for all $n > N$, elements of the sequence lie in an open ball around $x$ with radius $epsilon$.
Here is where my confusion comes in. From here, I know I need to draw on the definition of Hausdorff space. These are distinct points, and so there exist open sets around them containing the points, $x$ and $y$, where these sets are disjoint. This does not imply that every open set containing these points is disjoint. So, it seems that I need to say something to the effect that the definition of convergence allows me to create an open ball (I am using this interchangeable with open set, which I hope isn't incorrect; please correct me, if so) of any radius I want around
the points, and thus it clearly captures all such open sets. Thus, I can pick two separate $N$'s for each of these sets to form open balls of radius $epsilon_1$ and $epsilon_2$ around these points such that the sets are disjoint, which I know I can do via the definition of Hausdorff space. Since this would be true for an infinite number of $n$ past some arbitrary point $N$, it would not be possible to get "back inside" the opening ball around the other point. That's clearly a contradiction to the definition of convergence. Thus, if $a_n$ converges to $x$, it cannot converge to $y$, and if it converges to $y$, it cannot converge to $x$, so there is only a single possible limit point, which is unique.
How does this argument sound? Is there a better way to state it, or have I made an errors in logic?
Thanks in advance.
sequences-and-series general-topology proof-verification convergence
2
There's something you must pay attention to: when you say "Hausdorff space", a distance is not assumed to exist, and ever less a normed space structure, so you can't talk about balls of radius $epsilon$.
– Scientifica
Nov 17 at 23:46
add a comment |
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
This proof is likely quite trivial, but I was hoping someone could look it over regardless. There is one particular step I am confused on.
Theorem. The limit of a convergent sequence in a Hausdorff space is unique.
Proof. Let $a_n$ be a convergent sequence in a Hausdorf space. Suppose, for a contradiction, that it converges to two different points, $x$ and $y$. Thus, it follows from converges to $x$ that
begin{align*}
forall epsilon > 0, exists N, forall n > N, |a_n - x | < epsilon,
end{align*}
which is otherwise stated that for all $n > N$, elements of the sequence lie in some open ball around $x$ with radius $epsilon$.
From convergence to $y$, it follows that
begin{align*}
forall epsilon > 0, exists N, forall n > N, |a_n - y| < epsilon,
end{align*}
otherwise stated that for all $n > N$, elements of the sequence lie in an open ball around $x$ with radius $epsilon$.
Here is where my confusion comes in. From here, I know I need to draw on the definition of Hausdorff space. These are distinct points, and so there exist open sets around them containing the points, $x$ and $y$, where these sets are disjoint. This does not imply that every open set containing these points is disjoint. So, it seems that I need to say something to the effect that the definition of convergence allows me to create an open ball (I am using this interchangeable with open set, which I hope isn't incorrect; please correct me, if so) of any radius I want around
the points, and thus it clearly captures all such open sets. Thus, I can pick two separate $N$'s for each of these sets to form open balls of radius $epsilon_1$ and $epsilon_2$ around these points such that the sets are disjoint, which I know I can do via the definition of Hausdorff space. Since this would be true for an infinite number of $n$ past some arbitrary point $N$, it would not be possible to get "back inside" the opening ball around the other point. That's clearly a contradiction to the definition of convergence. Thus, if $a_n$ converges to $x$, it cannot converge to $y$, and if it converges to $y$, it cannot converge to $x$, so there is only a single possible limit point, which is unique.
How does this argument sound? Is there a better way to state it, or have I made an errors in logic?
Thanks in advance.
sequences-and-series general-topology proof-verification convergence
This proof is likely quite trivial, but I was hoping someone could look it over regardless. There is one particular step I am confused on.
Theorem. The limit of a convergent sequence in a Hausdorff space is unique.
Proof. Let $a_n$ be a convergent sequence in a Hausdorf space. Suppose, for a contradiction, that it converges to two different points, $x$ and $y$. Thus, it follows from converges to $x$ that
begin{align*}
forall epsilon > 0, exists N, forall n > N, |a_n - x | < epsilon,
end{align*}
which is otherwise stated that for all $n > N$, elements of the sequence lie in some open ball around $x$ with radius $epsilon$.
From convergence to $y$, it follows that
begin{align*}
forall epsilon > 0, exists N, forall n > N, |a_n - y| < epsilon,
end{align*}
otherwise stated that for all $n > N$, elements of the sequence lie in an open ball around $x$ with radius $epsilon$.
Here is where my confusion comes in. From here, I know I need to draw on the definition of Hausdorff space. These are distinct points, and so there exist open sets around them containing the points, $x$ and $y$, where these sets are disjoint. This does not imply that every open set containing these points is disjoint. So, it seems that I need to say something to the effect that the definition of convergence allows me to create an open ball (I am using this interchangeable with open set, which I hope isn't incorrect; please correct me, if so) of any radius I want around
the points, and thus it clearly captures all such open sets. Thus, I can pick two separate $N$'s for each of these sets to form open balls of radius $epsilon_1$ and $epsilon_2$ around these points such that the sets are disjoint, which I know I can do via the definition of Hausdorff space. Since this would be true for an infinite number of $n$ past some arbitrary point $N$, it would not be possible to get "back inside" the opening ball around the other point. That's clearly a contradiction to the definition of convergence. Thus, if $a_n$ converges to $x$, it cannot converge to $y$, and if it converges to $y$, it cannot converge to $x$, so there is only a single possible limit point, which is unique.
How does this argument sound? Is there a better way to state it, or have I made an errors in logic?
Thanks in advance.
sequences-and-series general-topology proof-verification convergence
sequences-and-series general-topology proof-verification convergence
edited Nov 17 at 23:47
Scientifica
6,13141332
6,13141332
asked Nov 17 at 23:41
Matt.P
1,036414
1,036414
2
There's something you must pay attention to: when you say "Hausdorff space", a distance is not assumed to exist, and ever less a normed space structure, so you can't talk about balls of radius $epsilon$.
– Scientifica
Nov 17 at 23:46
add a comment |
2
There's something you must pay attention to: when you say "Hausdorff space", a distance is not assumed to exist, and ever less a normed space structure, so you can't talk about balls of radius $epsilon$.
– Scientifica
Nov 17 at 23:46
2
2
There's something you must pay attention to: when you say "Hausdorff space", a distance is not assumed to exist, and ever less a normed space structure, so you can't talk about balls of radius $epsilon$.
– Scientifica
Nov 17 at 23:46
There's something you must pay attention to: when you say "Hausdorff space", a distance is not assumed to exist, and ever less a normed space structure, so you can't talk about balls of radius $epsilon$.
– Scientifica
Nov 17 at 23:46
add a comment |
3 Answers
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Suppose $x_n rightarrow x$, then if $x neq y$ there exists neighbourhoods $U,V$ of $x,y$ respectively that are disjoint by Hausdorfness. Next by definition of convergence, $U$ must contain all but finitely many of the $x_n$, and so $V$ cannot, and so $x_n$ cannot converge to $y$, because $V$ is a neighbourhood of $y$ that does not contain all but finitely many of the $x_n$. I think you should use this definition of convergence of a sequence in a topological space.
add a comment |
up vote
2
down vote
I would advise you to forget about radii when studying general topology: neighborhoods are a way more general notion; they do not come in with a radius.
Anyway, remember the definition of a Hausdorff space and that's all you're gonna need: If $x,yin X$ with $xneq y$ then we can find $U,V$ open sets with $xin U, yin V$ s.t. $Ucap V=emptyset$.
Okay, now suppose that $x_nto x,y$ and we want to prove that $x=y$. Suppose that this was not true, then we can find $U,V$ as above; but $x_nto x$ means by definition that for any open set $A$ with $xin A$ $(x_n)$ is contained in $A$ from some index and on. Do this for $U,V$ and you immediately have a contradiction, since they are disjoint.
Thank you for this answer. I think I understand the explanation, but just to be sure: beyond some $N$ (which might differ, I presume, for convergence to $x$ and $y$), every open set we construct might contain the limit point. I think where I am confused is that the definition of the Hausdorff space seems to only require the existence of a single disjoint open set. If these disjoint sets existed prior to $N$, the requirements would be satisfied. I am confident I am incorrect on this, but I cannot see why.
– Matt.P
Nov 18 at 0:00
1
Recall the definition of sequence-convergence in a topological space: we have that $x_nto x$ if and only if for any open set $U$ with $xin U$ there exists $n_0$ such that for all $ngeq n_0$ it is $x_nin U$. This is independent of the Hausdorff property! The sets $U,V$ mentioned on the definition of Hausdorff spaces depend only on the points $x,y$ mentioned and nothing else!
– JustDroppedIn
Nov 18 at 0:04
Thank you again. One more time, if you wouldn't mind, just to be sure I'm on the right page: by the definition of Hausdorff, we take disjoint open sets $U$ and $V$ around $x$ and $y$, respectively. By convergence to $x$, we can guarantee that an infinite number of points lie within one of these, say within $U$. But, if all but a finite number of points lie within $U$, then only a finite number of points lie within $V$, which contradicts the fact that we could guarantee an infinite number of points lie within $V$. The same would be true in the opposite direction. How is that?
– Matt.P
Nov 18 at 0:42
1
@Matt.P it's good:)
– JustDroppedIn
Nov 18 at 9:41
add a comment |
up vote
2
down vote
You are reasoning as if you're in the reals, and in the reals your argument isn't valid either as you wrote it. Just use definitions and the proof writes itself:
Suppose, for a contradiction, that for some sequence $(x_n)$ from $X$ we have $x,y in X$ with $(x_n) to x$ and $(x_n) to y$ and $x neq y$.
By the Hausdorff property, there are disjoint open sets $U$ and $V$ of $X$ such that $x in U$ and $y in V$.
As $x_n to x$, and $U$ is an open neighbourhood of $x$, there is a $N_0 in mathbb{N}$, such that for all $n ge N_0$ we have $x_n in U$. $(1)$
Also, as $x_n to y$, and $V$ is an open neighbourhood of $y$, there is a $N_1 in mathbb{N}$, such that for all $n ge N_1$ we have $x_n in V$. $(2)$
Now let $m= max(N_0, N_1)$, then $m ge N_0$ so $x_m in U$ by $(1)$ and also
$m ge N_1$ so by (2) we have $x_m in V$.
But then $x_m in U cap V$ contradicts the disjointness of $U$ and $V$.
This shows that all convergent sequences have a unique limit in a Hausdorff space.
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3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
4
down vote
Suppose $x_n rightarrow x$, then if $x neq y$ there exists neighbourhoods $U,V$ of $x,y$ respectively that are disjoint by Hausdorfness. Next by definition of convergence, $U$ must contain all but finitely many of the $x_n$, and so $V$ cannot, and so $x_n$ cannot converge to $y$, because $V$ is a neighbourhood of $y$ that does not contain all but finitely many of the $x_n$. I think you should use this definition of convergence of a sequence in a topological space.
add a comment |
up vote
4
down vote
Suppose $x_n rightarrow x$, then if $x neq y$ there exists neighbourhoods $U,V$ of $x,y$ respectively that are disjoint by Hausdorfness. Next by definition of convergence, $U$ must contain all but finitely many of the $x_n$, and so $V$ cannot, and so $x_n$ cannot converge to $y$, because $V$ is a neighbourhood of $y$ that does not contain all but finitely many of the $x_n$. I think you should use this definition of convergence of a sequence in a topological space.
add a comment |
up vote
4
down vote
up vote
4
down vote
Suppose $x_n rightarrow x$, then if $x neq y$ there exists neighbourhoods $U,V$ of $x,y$ respectively that are disjoint by Hausdorfness. Next by definition of convergence, $U$ must contain all but finitely many of the $x_n$, and so $V$ cannot, and so $x_n$ cannot converge to $y$, because $V$ is a neighbourhood of $y$ that does not contain all but finitely many of the $x_n$. I think you should use this definition of convergence of a sequence in a topological space.
Suppose $x_n rightarrow x$, then if $x neq y$ there exists neighbourhoods $U,V$ of $x,y$ respectively that are disjoint by Hausdorfness. Next by definition of convergence, $U$ must contain all but finitely many of the $x_n$, and so $V$ cannot, and so $x_n$ cannot converge to $y$, because $V$ is a neighbourhood of $y$ that does not contain all but finitely many of the $x_n$. I think you should use this definition of convergence of a sequence in a topological space.
answered Nov 17 at 23:48
IntegrateThis
1,7081717
1,7081717
add a comment |
add a comment |
up vote
2
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I would advise you to forget about radii when studying general topology: neighborhoods are a way more general notion; they do not come in with a radius.
Anyway, remember the definition of a Hausdorff space and that's all you're gonna need: If $x,yin X$ with $xneq y$ then we can find $U,V$ open sets with $xin U, yin V$ s.t. $Ucap V=emptyset$.
Okay, now suppose that $x_nto x,y$ and we want to prove that $x=y$. Suppose that this was not true, then we can find $U,V$ as above; but $x_nto x$ means by definition that for any open set $A$ with $xin A$ $(x_n)$ is contained in $A$ from some index and on. Do this for $U,V$ and you immediately have a contradiction, since they are disjoint.
Thank you for this answer. I think I understand the explanation, but just to be sure: beyond some $N$ (which might differ, I presume, for convergence to $x$ and $y$), every open set we construct might contain the limit point. I think where I am confused is that the definition of the Hausdorff space seems to only require the existence of a single disjoint open set. If these disjoint sets existed prior to $N$, the requirements would be satisfied. I am confident I am incorrect on this, but I cannot see why.
– Matt.P
Nov 18 at 0:00
1
Recall the definition of sequence-convergence in a topological space: we have that $x_nto x$ if and only if for any open set $U$ with $xin U$ there exists $n_0$ such that for all $ngeq n_0$ it is $x_nin U$. This is independent of the Hausdorff property! The sets $U,V$ mentioned on the definition of Hausdorff spaces depend only on the points $x,y$ mentioned and nothing else!
– JustDroppedIn
Nov 18 at 0:04
Thank you again. One more time, if you wouldn't mind, just to be sure I'm on the right page: by the definition of Hausdorff, we take disjoint open sets $U$ and $V$ around $x$ and $y$, respectively. By convergence to $x$, we can guarantee that an infinite number of points lie within one of these, say within $U$. But, if all but a finite number of points lie within $U$, then only a finite number of points lie within $V$, which contradicts the fact that we could guarantee an infinite number of points lie within $V$. The same would be true in the opposite direction. How is that?
– Matt.P
Nov 18 at 0:42
1
@Matt.P it's good:)
– JustDroppedIn
Nov 18 at 9:41
add a comment |
up vote
2
down vote
I would advise you to forget about radii when studying general topology: neighborhoods are a way more general notion; they do not come in with a radius.
Anyway, remember the definition of a Hausdorff space and that's all you're gonna need: If $x,yin X$ with $xneq y$ then we can find $U,V$ open sets with $xin U, yin V$ s.t. $Ucap V=emptyset$.
Okay, now suppose that $x_nto x,y$ and we want to prove that $x=y$. Suppose that this was not true, then we can find $U,V$ as above; but $x_nto x$ means by definition that for any open set $A$ with $xin A$ $(x_n)$ is contained in $A$ from some index and on. Do this for $U,V$ and you immediately have a contradiction, since they are disjoint.
Thank you for this answer. I think I understand the explanation, but just to be sure: beyond some $N$ (which might differ, I presume, for convergence to $x$ and $y$), every open set we construct might contain the limit point. I think where I am confused is that the definition of the Hausdorff space seems to only require the existence of a single disjoint open set. If these disjoint sets existed prior to $N$, the requirements would be satisfied. I am confident I am incorrect on this, but I cannot see why.
– Matt.P
Nov 18 at 0:00
1
Recall the definition of sequence-convergence in a topological space: we have that $x_nto x$ if and only if for any open set $U$ with $xin U$ there exists $n_0$ such that for all $ngeq n_0$ it is $x_nin U$. This is independent of the Hausdorff property! The sets $U,V$ mentioned on the definition of Hausdorff spaces depend only on the points $x,y$ mentioned and nothing else!
– JustDroppedIn
Nov 18 at 0:04
Thank you again. One more time, if you wouldn't mind, just to be sure I'm on the right page: by the definition of Hausdorff, we take disjoint open sets $U$ and $V$ around $x$ and $y$, respectively. By convergence to $x$, we can guarantee that an infinite number of points lie within one of these, say within $U$. But, if all but a finite number of points lie within $U$, then only a finite number of points lie within $V$, which contradicts the fact that we could guarantee an infinite number of points lie within $V$. The same would be true in the opposite direction. How is that?
– Matt.P
Nov 18 at 0:42
1
@Matt.P it's good:)
– JustDroppedIn
Nov 18 at 9:41
add a comment |
up vote
2
down vote
up vote
2
down vote
I would advise you to forget about radii when studying general topology: neighborhoods are a way more general notion; they do not come in with a radius.
Anyway, remember the definition of a Hausdorff space and that's all you're gonna need: If $x,yin X$ with $xneq y$ then we can find $U,V$ open sets with $xin U, yin V$ s.t. $Ucap V=emptyset$.
Okay, now suppose that $x_nto x,y$ and we want to prove that $x=y$. Suppose that this was not true, then we can find $U,V$ as above; but $x_nto x$ means by definition that for any open set $A$ with $xin A$ $(x_n)$ is contained in $A$ from some index and on. Do this for $U,V$ and you immediately have a contradiction, since they are disjoint.
I would advise you to forget about radii when studying general topology: neighborhoods are a way more general notion; they do not come in with a radius.
Anyway, remember the definition of a Hausdorff space and that's all you're gonna need: If $x,yin X$ with $xneq y$ then we can find $U,V$ open sets with $xin U, yin V$ s.t. $Ucap V=emptyset$.
Okay, now suppose that $x_nto x,y$ and we want to prove that $x=y$. Suppose that this was not true, then we can find $U,V$ as above; but $x_nto x$ means by definition that for any open set $A$ with $xin A$ $(x_n)$ is contained in $A$ from some index and on. Do this for $U,V$ and you immediately have a contradiction, since they are disjoint.
answered Nov 17 at 23:49
JustDroppedIn
1,759419
1,759419
Thank you for this answer. I think I understand the explanation, but just to be sure: beyond some $N$ (which might differ, I presume, for convergence to $x$ and $y$), every open set we construct might contain the limit point. I think where I am confused is that the definition of the Hausdorff space seems to only require the existence of a single disjoint open set. If these disjoint sets existed prior to $N$, the requirements would be satisfied. I am confident I am incorrect on this, but I cannot see why.
– Matt.P
Nov 18 at 0:00
1
Recall the definition of sequence-convergence in a topological space: we have that $x_nto x$ if and only if for any open set $U$ with $xin U$ there exists $n_0$ such that for all $ngeq n_0$ it is $x_nin U$. This is independent of the Hausdorff property! The sets $U,V$ mentioned on the definition of Hausdorff spaces depend only on the points $x,y$ mentioned and nothing else!
– JustDroppedIn
Nov 18 at 0:04
Thank you again. One more time, if you wouldn't mind, just to be sure I'm on the right page: by the definition of Hausdorff, we take disjoint open sets $U$ and $V$ around $x$ and $y$, respectively. By convergence to $x$, we can guarantee that an infinite number of points lie within one of these, say within $U$. But, if all but a finite number of points lie within $U$, then only a finite number of points lie within $V$, which contradicts the fact that we could guarantee an infinite number of points lie within $V$. The same would be true in the opposite direction. How is that?
– Matt.P
Nov 18 at 0:42
1
@Matt.P it's good:)
– JustDroppedIn
Nov 18 at 9:41
add a comment |
Thank you for this answer. I think I understand the explanation, but just to be sure: beyond some $N$ (which might differ, I presume, for convergence to $x$ and $y$), every open set we construct might contain the limit point. I think where I am confused is that the definition of the Hausdorff space seems to only require the existence of a single disjoint open set. If these disjoint sets existed prior to $N$, the requirements would be satisfied. I am confident I am incorrect on this, but I cannot see why.
– Matt.P
Nov 18 at 0:00
1
Recall the definition of sequence-convergence in a topological space: we have that $x_nto x$ if and only if for any open set $U$ with $xin U$ there exists $n_0$ such that for all $ngeq n_0$ it is $x_nin U$. This is independent of the Hausdorff property! The sets $U,V$ mentioned on the definition of Hausdorff spaces depend only on the points $x,y$ mentioned and nothing else!
– JustDroppedIn
Nov 18 at 0:04
Thank you again. One more time, if you wouldn't mind, just to be sure I'm on the right page: by the definition of Hausdorff, we take disjoint open sets $U$ and $V$ around $x$ and $y$, respectively. By convergence to $x$, we can guarantee that an infinite number of points lie within one of these, say within $U$. But, if all but a finite number of points lie within $U$, then only a finite number of points lie within $V$, which contradicts the fact that we could guarantee an infinite number of points lie within $V$. The same would be true in the opposite direction. How is that?
– Matt.P
Nov 18 at 0:42
1
@Matt.P it's good:)
– JustDroppedIn
Nov 18 at 9:41
Thank you for this answer. I think I understand the explanation, but just to be sure: beyond some $N$ (which might differ, I presume, for convergence to $x$ and $y$), every open set we construct might contain the limit point. I think where I am confused is that the definition of the Hausdorff space seems to only require the existence of a single disjoint open set. If these disjoint sets existed prior to $N$, the requirements would be satisfied. I am confident I am incorrect on this, but I cannot see why.
– Matt.P
Nov 18 at 0:00
Thank you for this answer. I think I understand the explanation, but just to be sure: beyond some $N$ (which might differ, I presume, for convergence to $x$ and $y$), every open set we construct might contain the limit point. I think where I am confused is that the definition of the Hausdorff space seems to only require the existence of a single disjoint open set. If these disjoint sets existed prior to $N$, the requirements would be satisfied. I am confident I am incorrect on this, but I cannot see why.
– Matt.P
Nov 18 at 0:00
1
1
Recall the definition of sequence-convergence in a topological space: we have that $x_nto x$ if and only if for any open set $U$ with $xin U$ there exists $n_0$ such that for all $ngeq n_0$ it is $x_nin U$. This is independent of the Hausdorff property! The sets $U,V$ mentioned on the definition of Hausdorff spaces depend only on the points $x,y$ mentioned and nothing else!
– JustDroppedIn
Nov 18 at 0:04
Recall the definition of sequence-convergence in a topological space: we have that $x_nto x$ if and only if for any open set $U$ with $xin U$ there exists $n_0$ such that for all $ngeq n_0$ it is $x_nin U$. This is independent of the Hausdorff property! The sets $U,V$ mentioned on the definition of Hausdorff spaces depend only on the points $x,y$ mentioned and nothing else!
– JustDroppedIn
Nov 18 at 0:04
Thank you again. One more time, if you wouldn't mind, just to be sure I'm on the right page: by the definition of Hausdorff, we take disjoint open sets $U$ and $V$ around $x$ and $y$, respectively. By convergence to $x$, we can guarantee that an infinite number of points lie within one of these, say within $U$. But, if all but a finite number of points lie within $U$, then only a finite number of points lie within $V$, which contradicts the fact that we could guarantee an infinite number of points lie within $V$. The same would be true in the opposite direction. How is that?
– Matt.P
Nov 18 at 0:42
Thank you again. One more time, if you wouldn't mind, just to be sure I'm on the right page: by the definition of Hausdorff, we take disjoint open sets $U$ and $V$ around $x$ and $y$, respectively. By convergence to $x$, we can guarantee that an infinite number of points lie within one of these, say within $U$. But, if all but a finite number of points lie within $U$, then only a finite number of points lie within $V$, which contradicts the fact that we could guarantee an infinite number of points lie within $V$. The same would be true in the opposite direction. How is that?
– Matt.P
Nov 18 at 0:42
1
1
@Matt.P it's good:)
– JustDroppedIn
Nov 18 at 9:41
@Matt.P it's good:)
– JustDroppedIn
Nov 18 at 9:41
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up vote
2
down vote
You are reasoning as if you're in the reals, and in the reals your argument isn't valid either as you wrote it. Just use definitions and the proof writes itself:
Suppose, for a contradiction, that for some sequence $(x_n)$ from $X$ we have $x,y in X$ with $(x_n) to x$ and $(x_n) to y$ and $x neq y$.
By the Hausdorff property, there are disjoint open sets $U$ and $V$ of $X$ such that $x in U$ and $y in V$.
As $x_n to x$, and $U$ is an open neighbourhood of $x$, there is a $N_0 in mathbb{N}$, such that for all $n ge N_0$ we have $x_n in U$. $(1)$
Also, as $x_n to y$, and $V$ is an open neighbourhood of $y$, there is a $N_1 in mathbb{N}$, such that for all $n ge N_1$ we have $x_n in V$. $(2)$
Now let $m= max(N_0, N_1)$, then $m ge N_0$ so $x_m in U$ by $(1)$ and also
$m ge N_1$ so by (2) we have $x_m in V$.
But then $x_m in U cap V$ contradicts the disjointness of $U$ and $V$.
This shows that all convergent sequences have a unique limit in a Hausdorff space.
add a comment |
up vote
2
down vote
You are reasoning as if you're in the reals, and in the reals your argument isn't valid either as you wrote it. Just use definitions and the proof writes itself:
Suppose, for a contradiction, that for some sequence $(x_n)$ from $X$ we have $x,y in X$ with $(x_n) to x$ and $(x_n) to y$ and $x neq y$.
By the Hausdorff property, there are disjoint open sets $U$ and $V$ of $X$ such that $x in U$ and $y in V$.
As $x_n to x$, and $U$ is an open neighbourhood of $x$, there is a $N_0 in mathbb{N}$, such that for all $n ge N_0$ we have $x_n in U$. $(1)$
Also, as $x_n to y$, and $V$ is an open neighbourhood of $y$, there is a $N_1 in mathbb{N}$, such that for all $n ge N_1$ we have $x_n in V$. $(2)$
Now let $m= max(N_0, N_1)$, then $m ge N_0$ so $x_m in U$ by $(1)$ and also
$m ge N_1$ so by (2) we have $x_m in V$.
But then $x_m in U cap V$ contradicts the disjointness of $U$ and $V$.
This shows that all convergent sequences have a unique limit in a Hausdorff space.
add a comment |
up vote
2
down vote
up vote
2
down vote
You are reasoning as if you're in the reals, and in the reals your argument isn't valid either as you wrote it. Just use definitions and the proof writes itself:
Suppose, for a contradiction, that for some sequence $(x_n)$ from $X$ we have $x,y in X$ with $(x_n) to x$ and $(x_n) to y$ and $x neq y$.
By the Hausdorff property, there are disjoint open sets $U$ and $V$ of $X$ such that $x in U$ and $y in V$.
As $x_n to x$, and $U$ is an open neighbourhood of $x$, there is a $N_0 in mathbb{N}$, such that for all $n ge N_0$ we have $x_n in U$. $(1)$
Also, as $x_n to y$, and $V$ is an open neighbourhood of $y$, there is a $N_1 in mathbb{N}$, such that for all $n ge N_1$ we have $x_n in V$. $(2)$
Now let $m= max(N_0, N_1)$, then $m ge N_0$ so $x_m in U$ by $(1)$ and also
$m ge N_1$ so by (2) we have $x_m in V$.
But then $x_m in U cap V$ contradicts the disjointness of $U$ and $V$.
This shows that all convergent sequences have a unique limit in a Hausdorff space.
You are reasoning as if you're in the reals, and in the reals your argument isn't valid either as you wrote it. Just use definitions and the proof writes itself:
Suppose, for a contradiction, that for some sequence $(x_n)$ from $X$ we have $x,y in X$ with $(x_n) to x$ and $(x_n) to y$ and $x neq y$.
By the Hausdorff property, there are disjoint open sets $U$ and $V$ of $X$ such that $x in U$ and $y in V$.
As $x_n to x$, and $U$ is an open neighbourhood of $x$, there is a $N_0 in mathbb{N}$, such that for all $n ge N_0$ we have $x_n in U$. $(1)$
Also, as $x_n to y$, and $V$ is an open neighbourhood of $y$, there is a $N_1 in mathbb{N}$, such that for all $n ge N_1$ we have $x_n in V$. $(2)$
Now let $m= max(N_0, N_1)$, then $m ge N_0$ so $x_m in U$ by $(1)$ and also
$m ge N_1$ so by (2) we have $x_m in V$.
But then $x_m in U cap V$ contradicts the disjointness of $U$ and $V$.
This shows that all convergent sequences have a unique limit in a Hausdorff space.
answered Nov 18 at 6:08
Henno Brandsma
102k345109
102k345109
add a comment |
add a comment |
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There's something you must pay attention to: when you say "Hausdorff space", a distance is not assumed to exist, and ever less a normed space structure, so you can't talk about balls of radius $epsilon$.
– Scientifica
Nov 17 at 23:46