Do monsters not follow the same rules as PCs for languages known?











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Reading up on languages it looks like characters are supposed to start play with their base languages plus one language per point of intelligence modifier.



Looking at monster stat blocks however this does not seem to be the case.



A Planetar has an Int score of 22 (+6) yet it only speaks 4 languages (Celestial, Draconic, Infernal, and Truespeak).



Dragons are no different. An Ancient Blue Dragon has an Int score of 20 (+5) and knows 6 languages. Dragons speak Common and Draconic starting out so the dragon should have at least one additional language.



Am I missing something here?










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  • 1




    Worth noting: a PC is an individual, while monsters are almost always average members of their race.
    – Michael W.
    Nov 20 at 22:24















up vote
7
down vote

favorite












Reading up on languages it looks like characters are supposed to start play with their base languages plus one language per point of intelligence modifier.



Looking at monster stat blocks however this does not seem to be the case.



A Planetar has an Int score of 22 (+6) yet it only speaks 4 languages (Celestial, Draconic, Infernal, and Truespeak).



Dragons are no different. An Ancient Blue Dragon has an Int score of 20 (+5) and knows 6 languages. Dragons speak Common and Draconic starting out so the dragon should have at least one additional language.



Am I missing something here?










share|improve this question




















  • 1




    Worth noting: a PC is an individual, while monsters are almost always average members of their race.
    – Michael W.
    Nov 20 at 22:24













up vote
7
down vote

favorite









up vote
7
down vote

favorite











Reading up on languages it looks like characters are supposed to start play with their base languages plus one language per point of intelligence modifier.



Looking at monster stat blocks however this does not seem to be the case.



A Planetar has an Int score of 22 (+6) yet it only speaks 4 languages (Celestial, Draconic, Infernal, and Truespeak).



Dragons are no different. An Ancient Blue Dragon has an Int score of 20 (+5) and knows 6 languages. Dragons speak Common and Draconic starting out so the dragon should have at least one additional language.



Am I missing something here?










share|improve this question















Reading up on languages it looks like characters are supposed to start play with their base languages plus one language per point of intelligence modifier.



Looking at monster stat blocks however this does not seem to be the case.



A Planetar has an Int score of 22 (+6) yet it only speaks 4 languages (Celestial, Draconic, Infernal, and Truespeak).



Dragons are no different. An Ancient Blue Dragon has an Int score of 20 (+5) and knows 6 languages. Dragons speak Common and Draconic starting out so the dragon should have at least one additional language.



Am I missing something here?







pathfinder monsters languages






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edited Nov 20 at 17:28









Rubiksmoose

44.6k6224340




44.6k6224340










asked Nov 20 at 15:07









Critical Crafting

2,681425




2,681425








  • 1




    Worth noting: a PC is an individual, while monsters are almost always average members of their race.
    – Michael W.
    Nov 20 at 22:24














  • 1




    Worth noting: a PC is an individual, while monsters are almost always average members of their race.
    – Michael W.
    Nov 20 at 22:24








1




1




Worth noting: a PC is an individual, while monsters are almost always average members of their race.
– Michael W.
Nov 20 at 22:24




Worth noting: a PC is an individual, while monsters are almost always average members of their race.
– Michael W.
Nov 20 at 22:24










3 Answers
3






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up vote
14
down vote



accepted










They don’t, no. I mean, arguably, they could just have a really short list of options for bonus languages—those lists aren’t printed anywhere for most (any?) monsters, and it could result in not being able to learn new languages even if your Intelligence would otherwise entitle you to some—but really, the answer is just no. They do not follow the same rules, they just know the languages they’re written up with.






share|improve this answer





















  • that is what I figured... but what if they were to have ranks in linguistics? Would their number of languages increase?
    – Critical Crafting
    Nov 20 at 15:21






  • 2




    @CriticalCrafting That would work normally; Linguistics doesn’t care what your bonus languages were, and there is no indication that the skill should work differently for monsters.
    – KRyan
    Nov 20 at 15:27


















up vote
10
down vote













They do not.



Answering this same question at Paizo's messageboards, James Jacobs (Paizo's Creative Director) said that bonus languages are arbitrary:




Monsters should always have at least one language listed if they have an Intelligence of 3 or higher; the number of base languages a monster knows, though, is relatively arbitrary.



Monsters with an Intelligence of 2 or 1 or those without intelligence at all NEVER know languages. This includes all vermin and animals. Communicating with them requires magic (like speak with animals) or other things like the aforementioned Handle Animal skill or wild empathy.







share|improve this answer




























    up vote
    7
    down vote













    PC ≠ Monsters



    Monsters are not created by the same rules as you build an PC, so no, you cannot apply any PC creation rules to monsters and expect that they will be followed.



    A summary of the moster creation rules can be found here. The intro already indicates normal straightforward rules apply (emphasis mine):




    Creating a monster is part science and part art. While most monsters follow a general patern of their overall power and abilities as related to their Challenge Rating(CR), there are many exceptions.




    Languages are not mention in the source but would follow under Step 10:Details which says (emphasis mine):




    Now that you have all of the creature's statisctics sorted out, t's time to fill in all the details - such as name alignment, space, reach , environment, and ecology - as you see fit.




    In other words figure out what you think is appropriate for your monster and go with it.






    share|improve this answer



















    • 2




      You need some backup for bold claims like that.
      – ShadowKras
      Nov 20 at 15:52











    Your Answer





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    3 Answers
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    3 Answers
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    up vote
    14
    down vote



    accepted










    They don’t, no. I mean, arguably, they could just have a really short list of options for bonus languages—those lists aren’t printed anywhere for most (any?) monsters, and it could result in not being able to learn new languages even if your Intelligence would otherwise entitle you to some—but really, the answer is just no. They do not follow the same rules, they just know the languages they’re written up with.






    share|improve this answer





















    • that is what I figured... but what if they were to have ranks in linguistics? Would their number of languages increase?
      – Critical Crafting
      Nov 20 at 15:21






    • 2




      @CriticalCrafting That would work normally; Linguistics doesn’t care what your bonus languages were, and there is no indication that the skill should work differently for monsters.
      – KRyan
      Nov 20 at 15:27















    up vote
    14
    down vote



    accepted










    They don’t, no. I mean, arguably, they could just have a really short list of options for bonus languages—those lists aren’t printed anywhere for most (any?) monsters, and it could result in not being able to learn new languages even if your Intelligence would otherwise entitle you to some—but really, the answer is just no. They do not follow the same rules, they just know the languages they’re written up with.






    share|improve this answer





















    • that is what I figured... but what if they were to have ranks in linguistics? Would their number of languages increase?
      – Critical Crafting
      Nov 20 at 15:21






    • 2




      @CriticalCrafting That would work normally; Linguistics doesn’t care what your bonus languages were, and there is no indication that the skill should work differently for monsters.
      – KRyan
      Nov 20 at 15:27













    up vote
    14
    down vote



    accepted







    up vote
    14
    down vote



    accepted






    They don’t, no. I mean, arguably, they could just have a really short list of options for bonus languages—those lists aren’t printed anywhere for most (any?) monsters, and it could result in not being able to learn new languages even if your Intelligence would otherwise entitle you to some—but really, the answer is just no. They do not follow the same rules, they just know the languages they’re written up with.






    share|improve this answer












    They don’t, no. I mean, arguably, they could just have a really short list of options for bonus languages—those lists aren’t printed anywhere for most (any?) monsters, and it could result in not being able to learn new languages even if your Intelligence would otherwise entitle you to some—but really, the answer is just no. They do not follow the same rules, they just know the languages they’re written up with.







    share|improve this answer












    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer










    answered Nov 20 at 15:12









    KRyan

    215k28539927




    215k28539927












    • that is what I figured... but what if they were to have ranks in linguistics? Would their number of languages increase?
      – Critical Crafting
      Nov 20 at 15:21






    • 2




      @CriticalCrafting That would work normally; Linguistics doesn’t care what your bonus languages were, and there is no indication that the skill should work differently for monsters.
      – KRyan
      Nov 20 at 15:27


















    • that is what I figured... but what if they were to have ranks in linguistics? Would their number of languages increase?
      – Critical Crafting
      Nov 20 at 15:21






    • 2




      @CriticalCrafting That would work normally; Linguistics doesn’t care what your bonus languages were, and there is no indication that the skill should work differently for monsters.
      – KRyan
      Nov 20 at 15:27
















    that is what I figured... but what if they were to have ranks in linguistics? Would their number of languages increase?
    – Critical Crafting
    Nov 20 at 15:21




    that is what I figured... but what if they were to have ranks in linguistics? Would their number of languages increase?
    – Critical Crafting
    Nov 20 at 15:21




    2




    2




    @CriticalCrafting That would work normally; Linguistics doesn’t care what your bonus languages were, and there is no indication that the skill should work differently for monsters.
    – KRyan
    Nov 20 at 15:27




    @CriticalCrafting That would work normally; Linguistics doesn’t care what your bonus languages were, and there is no indication that the skill should work differently for monsters.
    – KRyan
    Nov 20 at 15:27












    up vote
    10
    down vote













    They do not.



    Answering this same question at Paizo's messageboards, James Jacobs (Paizo's Creative Director) said that bonus languages are arbitrary:




    Monsters should always have at least one language listed if they have an Intelligence of 3 or higher; the number of base languages a monster knows, though, is relatively arbitrary.



    Monsters with an Intelligence of 2 or 1 or those without intelligence at all NEVER know languages. This includes all vermin and animals. Communicating with them requires magic (like speak with animals) or other things like the aforementioned Handle Animal skill or wild empathy.







    share|improve this answer

























      up vote
      10
      down vote













      They do not.



      Answering this same question at Paizo's messageboards, James Jacobs (Paizo's Creative Director) said that bonus languages are arbitrary:




      Monsters should always have at least one language listed if they have an Intelligence of 3 or higher; the number of base languages a monster knows, though, is relatively arbitrary.



      Monsters with an Intelligence of 2 or 1 or those without intelligence at all NEVER know languages. This includes all vermin and animals. Communicating with them requires magic (like speak with animals) or other things like the aforementioned Handle Animal skill or wild empathy.







      share|improve this answer























        up vote
        10
        down vote










        up vote
        10
        down vote









        They do not.



        Answering this same question at Paizo's messageboards, James Jacobs (Paizo's Creative Director) said that bonus languages are arbitrary:




        Monsters should always have at least one language listed if they have an Intelligence of 3 or higher; the number of base languages a monster knows, though, is relatively arbitrary.



        Monsters with an Intelligence of 2 or 1 or those without intelligence at all NEVER know languages. This includes all vermin and animals. Communicating with them requires magic (like speak with animals) or other things like the aforementioned Handle Animal skill or wild empathy.







        share|improve this answer












        They do not.



        Answering this same question at Paizo's messageboards, James Jacobs (Paizo's Creative Director) said that bonus languages are arbitrary:




        Monsters should always have at least one language listed if they have an Intelligence of 3 or higher; the number of base languages a monster knows, though, is relatively arbitrary.



        Monsters with an Intelligence of 2 or 1 or those without intelligence at all NEVER know languages. This includes all vermin and animals. Communicating with them requires magic (like speak with animals) or other things like the aforementioned Handle Animal skill or wild empathy.








        share|improve this answer












        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer










        answered Nov 20 at 15:55









        ShadowKras

        47.2k366124




        47.2k366124






















            up vote
            7
            down vote













            PC ≠ Monsters



            Monsters are not created by the same rules as you build an PC, so no, you cannot apply any PC creation rules to monsters and expect that they will be followed.



            A summary of the moster creation rules can be found here. The intro already indicates normal straightforward rules apply (emphasis mine):




            Creating a monster is part science and part art. While most monsters follow a general patern of their overall power and abilities as related to their Challenge Rating(CR), there are many exceptions.




            Languages are not mention in the source but would follow under Step 10:Details which says (emphasis mine):




            Now that you have all of the creature's statisctics sorted out, t's time to fill in all the details - such as name alignment, space, reach , environment, and ecology - as you see fit.




            In other words figure out what you think is appropriate for your monster and go with it.






            share|improve this answer



















            • 2




              You need some backup for bold claims like that.
              – ShadowKras
              Nov 20 at 15:52















            up vote
            7
            down vote













            PC ≠ Monsters



            Monsters are not created by the same rules as you build an PC, so no, you cannot apply any PC creation rules to monsters and expect that they will be followed.



            A summary of the moster creation rules can be found here. The intro already indicates normal straightforward rules apply (emphasis mine):




            Creating a monster is part science and part art. While most monsters follow a general patern of their overall power and abilities as related to their Challenge Rating(CR), there are many exceptions.




            Languages are not mention in the source but would follow under Step 10:Details which says (emphasis mine):




            Now that you have all of the creature's statisctics sorted out, t's time to fill in all the details - such as name alignment, space, reach , environment, and ecology - as you see fit.




            In other words figure out what you think is appropriate for your monster and go with it.






            share|improve this answer



















            • 2




              You need some backup for bold claims like that.
              – ShadowKras
              Nov 20 at 15:52













            up vote
            7
            down vote










            up vote
            7
            down vote









            PC ≠ Monsters



            Monsters are not created by the same rules as you build an PC, so no, you cannot apply any PC creation rules to monsters and expect that they will be followed.



            A summary of the moster creation rules can be found here. The intro already indicates normal straightforward rules apply (emphasis mine):




            Creating a monster is part science and part art. While most monsters follow a general patern of their overall power and abilities as related to their Challenge Rating(CR), there are many exceptions.




            Languages are not mention in the source but would follow under Step 10:Details which says (emphasis mine):




            Now that you have all of the creature's statisctics sorted out, t's time to fill in all the details - such as name alignment, space, reach , environment, and ecology - as you see fit.




            In other words figure out what you think is appropriate for your monster and go with it.






            share|improve this answer














            PC ≠ Monsters



            Monsters are not created by the same rules as you build an PC, so no, you cannot apply any PC creation rules to monsters and expect that they will be followed.



            A summary of the moster creation rules can be found here. The intro already indicates normal straightforward rules apply (emphasis mine):




            Creating a monster is part science and part art. While most monsters follow a general patern of their overall power and abilities as related to their Challenge Rating(CR), there are many exceptions.




            Languages are not mention in the source but would follow under Step 10:Details which says (emphasis mine):




            Now that you have all of the creature's statisctics sorted out, t's time to fill in all the details - such as name alignment, space, reach , environment, and ecology - as you see fit.




            In other words figure out what you think is appropriate for your monster and go with it.







            share|improve this answer














            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer








            edited Nov 20 at 16:09

























            answered Nov 20 at 15:14









            Dinomaster

            2,818722




            2,818722








            • 2




              You need some backup for bold claims like that.
              – ShadowKras
              Nov 20 at 15:52














            • 2




              You need some backup for bold claims like that.
              – ShadowKras
              Nov 20 at 15:52








            2




            2




            You need some backup for bold claims like that.
            – ShadowKras
            Nov 20 at 15:52




            You need some backup for bold claims like that.
            – ShadowKras
            Nov 20 at 15:52


















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